--- Day changed

--- Log opened Sat May 24 00:00:02 2003
01:20 < david> wooh
01:20 < david> config thing is nice now
01:21 < caker> is it all loaded into an array or something? could you put the number of sub-options in the main page?
01:21 < caker> example: Library routines (0)
01:25 < caker> very nice
01:34 < david> nod
01:34 < david> I can do that
--- Log closed Sat May 24 03:19:04 2003

--- Log opened Sat May 24 03:19:34 2003
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05:48 < caker> is it just me, or is slackware kind of fast?
05:49 < green> hehe ;)
05:50 < Lathiat> slackware is slow
05:51 < caker> Lathiat: it's booting very quickly, and starting just as much crap as RedHat .. it's kind of bare-bones in the rc.d department
05:51  * green does not care about start time. I do not reboot often, and when I doo, HW init stuff takes longer anyway
05:52 < Lathiat> thats because you run redhat
05:52 < Lathiat> heh
05:53 < green> Lathiat: what's because I run RedHat? the HW init stuff times? ;)
06:00 < ElectricElf> green: RH's initscripts are huge.
06:01 < ElectricElf> green: That alone should make a percievable difference.
06:06 < green> ElectricElf: well, if you call few (less than 10) seconds perceivable, then probably yes. But you do not have RH's scripts flexibility in slackware. (as an exercise: try to drop to the single user mode and then back to multiuser one in slackware)
06:06 < ElectricElf> green: You noticed it, didn't you? :)
06:06 < ElectricElf> (That makes it perceivable.)
06:07 < green> nope.
06:07 < ElectricElf> Oh, caker was the one who originally noted it.
06:07 < green> for me slackware scripts took much longer because when I was using slackware, computes still were relatiely slow ;)
06:07 < ElectricElf> green: I don't care which is "better", I was just trying to point out *why* it was faster for him.
06:08 < caker> ElectricElf: I agree, RedHat's are much larger, and I never realized until now how much longer they take.  But I also won't take them for granted.
06:08 < ElectricElf> caker: Do you happen to know what interpreter they use?
06:08 < ElectricElf> caker: (Bash?)
06:08 < caker> ElectricElf: looks that way
06:08  * green think that the longest part in RH scripts is "hw autodetection", once you do "service kudzu off", RH suddenly starts much faster ;)
06:08 < ElectricElf> Hmm, dash is singificantly faster. Maybe they'll port them.
06:08 < BB> green i agree with that one ;)
06:09 < caker> yup, bash
06:09 < ElectricElf> caker: Do you care how much better RH is than anything else? :)
06:09 < caker> ElectricElf: no ?
06:09 < ElectricElf> Hmm, nor I.
06:09  * ElectricElf looks pointed at green
06:09  * green values his own time. So I choose tools that save my time.
06:10 < green> it's too expensive to be wasted
06:10 < ElectricElf> green: I don't care.
06:10 < BB> green i value the pub, wates time but you dont care how long that fsck takes on a 100GB drive
06:10 < ElectricElf> green: Seriously, just relax :)
06:10 < ElectricElf> green: He asked a technical question, "why does <foo> act different than <bar>?"
06:10 < green> BB: sure I don't, I do not run fsck ;)
06:10 < BB> green heh
06:10 < green> ElectricElf: sure.
06:10 < ElectricElf> Great.
06:11 < green> ElectricElf: I had technical answer "<bar> is longer because it have more fuunctionality in it" if you missed that ;)
06:12  * ElectricElf ignores the troll :)
06:12 < caker> lol
06:12 < caker> you guys are fun.
06:13 < caker> personally, I use init=/bin/bash
06:13 < caker> starts right up
06:13 < green> caker: that does not work without reboot
06:13 < ElectricElf> caker: Bah, Real Men(tm) use init=/bin/emacs :)
06:14  * BB runs from ElectricElf 
06:14 < caker> ok then.. how about: echo "co:2345:respawn:/bin/bash" > /etc/inittab; init q
06:14 < ElectricElf> BB: I don't even use it, it's entirely a joke ;)
06:15 < caker> funny :-)
06:15 < ElectricElf> (Well, occasionally I'll fire it up for texinfo.)
06:15 < ElectricElf> caker: I actually know somebody who does use Emacs in that fasion.
06:15 < caker> I've never used emacs.. I've managed with about 10 vim commands for years
06:15 < BB> ElectricElf heh well your one to fear for even making such a joke ;)
06:16 < ElectricElf> BB: lol
06:16 < ElectricElf> caker: She doesn't do much editing, ironically.
06:16 < green> caker: So have you figured out how to switch between those two vi modes yet (the Corrupting and the Beeping modes, I mean) ;)
06:16 < caker> green: heh .. just hit ESC about 5 times after everything, and you're gold
06:17 < ElectricElf> caker: I prefer Ctrl+C, but it's not portable :|
06:17 < BB> caker lol we must have the same vi teacher
06:17 < caker> lol
06:17 < green> caker: well, after some keypresses 5 escs will make things even worse
06:17 < caker> ElectricElf: i don't think vi likes a control-c :-)
06:17 < ElectricElf> caker: It doesn't, but Vim does :)
06:18 < green> caker: depends on the flavour. Slackware was shipped with elvis initially and ^c dropped you into ex mode there, I think
06:18 < ElectricElf> caker: Most implementations go into normal mode and move the cursor to 0,0.
06:18 < ElectricElf> (If they don't do something weirder, anyways)
06:18 < caker> strange
06:37  * caker goes to sleep
07:12 < ichilton> anyone seen this before?
07:12 < ichilton> Kernel panic: restore_registers - saving registers failed, errno = -1
07:12 < ichilton>  <6>Stopping all CPUs...done
07:14 < ichilton> or
07:14 < ichilton> Mounted devfs on /dev
07:14 < ichilton> Kernel panic: restore_registers - saving registers failed, errno = -1
07:15 < ichilton> ad
07:15 < ichilton> oops
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10:02 < Getty> good morning! :)
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14:54 < Getty> hey not much activity, wha? ;)
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15:31 < snide> nope
15:40 < Getty> ah
15:40 < Getty> pulse ;)
15:42 < Lathiat>  03:41:20 up 29 days,  7:54,  8 users,  load average: 8.09, 7.82, 6.94
15:42 < Lathiat> mmm bochs sends load +++++ :)
15:43 < Getty> bochs is this kind of os in the beginning, right? :)
15:43 < Lathiat> bochs is the reason uml exists
15:43 < Lathiat> not to use it :P
15:43 < Lathiat> cept theres no uml for freebsd
15:44 < Getty> yeah ;)
15:46 < green> Lathiat: there's vmware
15:46 < Lathiat> yeh im thinkin even on this p200 
15:46 < Lathiat> vmware would be preferable
15:46 < Lathiat> but 
15:46 < Lathiat> vmware wont run in my putty sesion
15:47 < Lathiat> http://peter.striked.org:81/~peter/bochs2.jpg
15:47 < Lathiat> like that
15:47 < green> Lathiat: why do you need vmware in putty session? run vmware on remote side and telnet into it
15:48 < Getty> vmware is some kind of much more load ;)
15:48 < green> Getty: not much, I guess
15:49 < green> Getty: and there is no alternative anyway
15:49 < Getty> my tests with vmware were terrible
15:49 < BB> vmware 4 is quite nice
15:49 < Lathiat> green; yeh but i cant set it up remotely ;)
15:49 < green> Lathiat: yes you can
15:49 < Lathiat> id ont wanan vnc from my 56k
15:50 < Getty> you can if you like ;)
15:50 < Getty> hehe
15:50 < green> you do not need to vnc
15:50 < Getty> RDP rocks <hide>
15:50 < Lathiat> how?
15:50 < Lathiat> hah gety
15:50 < green> use vmware gsx server, it does not needs X
15:50 < Getty> yeah
15:50 < snide> green: $$$ ;(
15:50 < Getty> buy one get one fre
15:50 < Getty> ;-)
15:50 < green> snide: this is not a problem ;)
15:50 < BB> Getty nout wrong with abit of RDP :)
15:51 < Getty> mout?
15:51 < BB> nout - nothing
15:51 < Getty> ah ok
15:51 < Getty> yeah rdp is really fast
15:51 < Getty> i like my windows terminal server in office
15:52 < Getty> (he is only there for my emule ;) )
15:52  * BB was playing with it over GPRS today, didnt seem too bad ... if alittle small screen size heh
15:52  * Lathiat steals a copy of gsx from a friend
15:52 < Getty> BB: it rocks even on 14k4 ;)
15:52 < green> Lathiat: you can get evaluation copy directly from vmware
15:53 < Lathiat> i coudl do that in the meantime
15:53 < BB> Getty dont tell my boss that or the 2mbps fill dissapear lol
15:53 < BB> fill=will
15:54 < Getty> hehe
15:54 < green> Getty: btw I have translated that file. where should I send it?
15:55 < Getty> green: good question, to the debian package maintainer would be fastest way
15:55 < Getty> (i think)
15:55 < Getty> isn't there an email into?
15:56 < green> no
15:56 < green> i can send it to you and you can send it to whoerer might be interested. just tell me your email ;)
16:01 < Getty> ok
16:01 < Getty> torsten@raudssus.de
16:01 < Getty> i will manage this
16:10 < green> ok. sent it
16:14 < green> Getty: btw the translation is in "koi8-r" encoding. this is important info to include into disclaimer
16:18 < Getty> has you put that info into the file?
16:18 < Getty> would be best way to be sure everybody gets the info who needs it
16:18 < green> nope.
16:18 < Getty> i will do then
16:18 < green> sure
16:21 < Getty> yes 739 emails
16:24 < Lathiat> id hate to sift through linus' inbox
16:25 < Lathiat> aparently he doesnt run a spam killer
16:25 < Lathiat> so he tld me
16:25 < green> he have sophisticated mail filters ;)
16:25 < Lathiat> i suspect anythign without an explicit allow > /dev/null ;)
16:25 < Lathiat> he said he doesnt feel guilty auto-trashing mail anymore heh
16:26 < green> hehe
16:26 < green> he prefers to do it himself these days
16:26 < green> "reading mail with D key" as he calls it
16:26 < Lathiat> he must spend like 12 hours in the day doing email heh
16:26 < Lathiat> i need to hack his mail client so that the D key opens mail :P
16:26 < green> Lathiat: reading mail with the D key should not take too long ;)
16:27 < Lathiat> and enter deletes it
16:27 < green> he uses pine, so should not be hard to do
16:27 < Lathiat> i like mutt personally
16:27 < green> same here ;)
16:27 < Lathiat> any ideas on how i can tell procmail to push my mail through spamassasin
16:27 < caker> green: I am still laughing about the "vi" two modes (corrupting and beeping)
16:27 < Lathiat> BUT continue traversin gthe rest of my procmail rules
16:28 < Lathiat> heh caker
16:28  * BB uses Outlook <g>
16:28  * BB runs
16:28 < green> Lathiat: I run spamassasin on the mail hub from sendmail, that saves me traffic
16:28 < caker> green: I never laugh like that, but I was laughing all last evening
16:28 < green> Lathiat: but they have examples of what you need in their docs
16:28  * caker thanks green
16:28 < Lathiat> i read my mail on the erver it ends up on
16:28 < green> caker: you mean you have not heard that old joke before? ;)
16:28 < Lathiat> i own the box heh
16:29 < Lathiat> i just ssh in
16:29 < caker> green: no, but it's brilliant
16:29 < caker> green: because it's so true :)
16:29 < Lathiat> hrm well postfix icurrently set to deliver via procmail
16:29 < green> Lathiat: I own the box too, but still it is somewhat not intuitive that I need to ssh somewhere to read the mail
16:29 < Lathiat> so if i set it to spamassasin
16:29 < Lathiat> postfix wotn work anymore?
16:29 < green> caker: wait I'll give you the whole text
16:29 < caker> green: hook me up
16:29 < Lathiat> green; see i check my mail from 2 houses and school and a computer club ;)
16:29 < green> Lathiat: why not?
16:29 < Lathiat> s/postfix/procmail
16:30 < Lathiat> how do i make it do both cus like
16:30 < Lathiat> bah
16:30 < green> Lathiat: I telnet to home and read the mail from remote locations this way
16:30 < Lathiat> you TELNET?
16:30 < Lathiat> ewww
16:30  * BB uses terminal server to read mail when away <g>
16:30 < green> telnet == remotely connect ;)
16:30 < Lathiat> right then :P
16:30 < Lathiat> green: u met rusty?
16:30 < Lathiat> hes one funny guy ;)
16:31 < Lathiat> thats what i love about linux - everyone is cool 
16:31 < caker> chicks dig linux
16:31 < green> Lathiat: I have not met anyone. I am living in isolated country and no other country likes to invite citizens of my country
16:31 < Lathiat> green; that sucks
16:31 < Lathiat> i only met a few cus i was an organiser at linux.conf.au 2003
16:32 < Lathiat> so i ran intio linux, rusty, alan, telsa, rasmus, tridge, bdale, and lots of other cool people
16:32 < Lathiat> argh i spelt his name wrong
16:32  * Lathiat shoots himself
16:32 < Lathiat> u goto opensbd and their people dont seem very friendly at all
16:33  * BB would invite green round if he brought the vodka ;)
16:33 < Lathiat> haha
16:33 < green> BB: no problems. You pay the air tickets and hotel and I bring you vidka in exchange ;)
16:33 < green> s/vidka/vodka/
16:33  * Lathiat grins
16:33 < BB> heh ok i'm start to save
16:33 < green> BB: UK must be interesting country to visit ;)
16:34 < Lathiat> any1 here coming to linux.conf.au 2004?
16:34 < Lathiat> over here in the middle of no-where, australia.
16:34 < BB> .au is miles away :(
16:34 < Lathiat> jeff came once :P
16:34 < Lathiat> iirc
16:35 < green> Lathiat: Only if the conference will pay for me, I can give some reiser4 talks. Hans dreams about us (the reiserfs programmers) go everywhere and tell about how good reiser4 is ;)
16:35 < green> all of the conference's organizers expence ;)
16:35 < Lathiat> green; well sumit a paper when the cfp opens ;)
16:35 < Lathiat> maybe I'll see you there o_O
16:35 < Lathiat> then i can abuse you cus i lost my /home to reiserfs
16:35 < green> Lathiat: need to finish that reiser4 first ;)
16:36 < Lathiat> /usr/src/kernel-headers-2.4.20-1-586tsc/include/asm/system.h: In function `__set_64bit_var':
16:36 < Lathiat> /usr/src/kernel-headers-2.4.20-1-586tsc/include/asm/system.h:190: warning: dereferencing type-punned pointer will break strict-aliasing rules
16:36 < Lathiat> yay for binary drivers
16:36 < green> caker: cannot find full joke right now, will tell you later
16:36 < green> Lathiat: well, perhaps you have not really tried to recover it ;)
16:37 < Lathiat> im sure david sent you the metadata
16:37 < Lathiat> or was it oleg
16:37 < Lathiat> reiserfsck fried it good
16:37 < green> ah. right. that was documented limitation.
16:37 < Lathiat> documented in a paper book under 3 piles of crap in someones house? ;)
16:37 < green> never store reiserfs filesystems on reiserfs in raw form if you plan to run rebuild-tree operation
16:38 < green> no, documented in FAQ, I think
16:38 < Lathiat> and why is that?
16:38 < Lathiat> it finds the reiser fs in the middle of the drive and messes with its mind?
16:39 < green> because reiserfsck cannot tell if this metadata is from it or not. We do not have fixed metadata location as other filesystems do. it have its own benefits (like no limit on number of inodes) and is own drawbacks
16:39 < Lathiat> http://www.sixlabs.org/~lathiat/freebsd-install.jpg <-- it hink thats impressive
16:39 < Lathiat> greeen; ahhh
16:39 < Lathiat> well uh
16:39 < Lathiat> damn you
16:39 < Lathiat> fix it :P
16:39 < Lathiat> then ill take the patch back in time
16:39 < green> yeah, we are thinking on how to deal with that but see no reliable solution yet
16:40 < Lathiat> cant u liek check its not within a file or something?
16:40 < green> this is not reliable
16:40 < Lathiat> why not?
16:40 < green> there might be data corruption patterns that will make fsck think all the metadata is belongs to some file
16:41 < Lathiat> ahh
16:41 < Lathiat> well i know 0 about filesystems, specifically reiser so ;)
16:41  * Lathiat shuts up
16:41 < green> or consider a deleted file that that had some block used. block is freed, metadata is still there, then suddenly due to one bit error, that metadata is used again, but the freed block now contains valid piece of metadata...
16:42 < Lathiat> ahh
16:42 < Lathiat> eek
16:42 < Lathiat> it picked 172.16.229.0/24
16:42 < Lathiat> stupdi vmware
16:42 < Lathiat> we use 172.16.0.0/12 around here
16:43  * green personally sees zero sence in using journaling filesystems in UML (besides doing their debugging ;) )
16:43 < green> uml saves so much time in debugging for me now. and whole separate box too
16:43 < Lathiat> of reiser?
16:44 < Lathiat> yeh i suspect it would. specially if u bugger sumthin up u can just put an old image back.
16:44 < green> reiserfs, reiser4, quota and other stuff I ocasionally deal with
16:44 < Lathiat> 04:42  * Lathiat waves
16:44 < Lathiat> 04:42 <@Lathiat> 4:30am
16:44 < Lathiat> 04:42 <@Lathiat> sleep time
16:44 < Lathiat> 04:42 <+KoRn_02> wow
16:44 < Lathiat> 04:42 <+KoRn_02> 430am
16:44 < Lathiat> 04:42 <+KoRn_02> dammmmmmmm
16:44 < Lathiat> i dont think he ircs very much
16:44  * Lathiat laughs
16:46  * Lathiat waves
16:46 < Lathiat> night.
16:46 < Lathiat> well morning.
16:48 < BB> heh
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17:12 < snide> green: so, on which fs type do u put ur reiser4 udb ? ext2 ?
17:24 < snide> Lathiat: still here ?
17:30 < BB> hmm lmao just looked on ba.com it takes 2 days to get to australia
17:31 < snide> Lathiat: to make procmail still use the following rules, u have to use 'formail' as a | after spamassain
17:36 -!- snide [~snide@81.53.158.62] has quit [Quit: [BX] Do you... BitchX?]
18:14 < caker> Neato!
18:14 < caker> http://www.theshore.net/uml/irc/stats/
18:14  * BB used /me lots
18:16 < caker> heh
19:00 < ElectricElf> Getty: I'm here now, if you wanted something?
19:01 < ElectricElf> Getty: (Incidentally, I tend to ignore /msg's. But I have excellent highlighting rules, so if you say anything to/about me in here, I'll see it when I sit down at my workstation. :)
19:11 -!- pirlouit [~peter@64.162.195.202] has quit [Quit: Time to frag!]
19:34 < Getty> what was the thing you told me some days ago
19:34 < Getty> ElectricElf
19:34 < ElectricElf> Getty: I think I asked you what problems you were having with debootstrap?
19:34 < Getty> no you gave me some "hint"
19:35 < ElectricElf> lol :)
19:35 < ElectricElf> Getty: What about?
19:35 < Getty> i not remember ;)
19:35 < Getty> but ok i should look logs...
19:35 < ElectricElf> Getty: Checking mine, I don't see anything.
19:36 < Getty> mom phone
19:55 < Getty> re
19:55 < Getty> girls ;)
19:56 < BB> girls ? where!
19:57 < Getty> two ?
19:57 < Getty> you need
19:58 < BB> you could say that
20:01 < Getty> electricelf: yeah it was about debootstrap right
20:01 < BB> hymm £174 quid on accessories is a tad too much aint it
20:01 < Getty> electricelf: hehe :)
20:01 < BB> doh wrong channel
20:02 < Getty> BB: you are talking about SM-accessories? ;)
20:02 < BB> Getty accessories for xda :P
20:02 < Getty> oh ok... ;)
--- Log closed Sat May 24 20:15:03 2003

--- Log opened Sat May 24 20:15:22 2003
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22:39 < Getty> sh*t i still not get the thing about the memory
22:43 < Getty> but i think noone is awake anyway ;)
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