--- Day changed

--- Log opened Mon May 23 23:59:03 2005
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01:47 < tessier_> I would ask him but he is not available at the moment. The only thing I have heard about these blades is second hand from someone else.
01:48 < tessier_> I think good hardware is worth paying for if you have the money.
01:48 < tessier_> Unfortunately like many employers mine does not.
01:48 < tessier_> And always goes for the cheapest solutions.
01:48 < tessier_> They just lost an hd on the accounting/inventory system. Fsck'd right in the arse they are.
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02:16 < cartel_> hey all
02:16 < cartel_> looking for some doc / help on pci device exclusion and pci = [ 'x,y,z' ]
02:32 < cartel_> nm, seems to be working now
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03:08 < mael> hi
03:21 -!- betonamu [~Administr@dhcp-243-187.mag.keio.ac.jp] has joined #xen
03:23 < betonamu> hello, anybody here?  i run "xm list", and it shows one VCPU column, but what does VCPU mean in xen?
03:32 < mael> you must run "unstable", no?
03:32 < mael> I think this mean "Virtual CPU"
03:33 < betonamu> mael: yes, unstable
03:33 < mael> xen 3 will support multiple cpu for domains
03:33 < mael> so they added the VCPU stuff
03:33 < mael> (if I understood correctly)
03:33 < betonamu> multiple cpu for domain? that means one domain runs on multiple cpu?
03:34 < mael> It mean you can emulate SMP system
03:34 < mael> the domain sees 'n' VCPU
03:34 < mael> and the VCPU can be real CPU or not
03:35 < betonamu> ah that is great. how many cpu can i set for one domain? any limition?
03:35 < betonamu> and how to set that?
03:35 < mael> well, I don't know :)
03:35 < mael> I haven't been playing with unstable yet :)
03:36 < mael> but I guess some devs here might tell
03:36 < betonamu> that is nice to emulate SMP. so developer can write program for smp without having the real hardware :)
03:37 < mael> betonamu:  domain/context switching overhead will give you a limit
03:37 < mael> and I presume this will happen very fast
03:37 < betonamu> how to calculate/estimate that limit?
03:37 < mael> you should test and tell me!
03:38 < betonamu> :) the problem is that i dont know how to test
03:39 < betonamu> looks like there are smt like vcpu_to_cpu setting in sxp
03:39 < betonamu> and "cpumap"
03:40 < mael> I hope I was right anyway, because as I told you, this is just guessing
03:40 < betonamu> yeah but that makes sense to me
03:40 < betonamu> or it works this way: this is not to emulate SMP
03:41 < betonamu> if you have N cpu, you can configure to give some to a domain
03:41 < betonamu> like CPU1, CPU3 and CPU4 - not CPU2
03:41 < betonamu> i guess this is more practical
03:42 < betonamu> virtual CPUs are always count from 1 up
03:42 < mael> betonamu:  well I'm not sure, because I think cpu pinning already existed in xen 2
03:43 < mael> I'm download unstable sources...
03:43 < mael> +ing
03:43 < betonamu> yes i am reading code rite now to figure this out
03:46 < mael> there a #define MAX_VIRT_CPUS 32 in xen/include/public/xen.h
03:47 < betonamu> hmm.. just found a small bug in xm/main.py :)
03:47 < mael> and MAX_VIRT_CPUS seem to be used for the vcpu stuff
03:48 < betonamu> to make (a patch) or not to make  :)
03:53 < betonamu> mael: if i want to compile a kernel module for domU, what i must do?
03:53 < mael> betonamu:  there's a vcpu.c in ia64 arch only
03:54 < mael> betonamu:  recompile using arch=xen
03:54 < betonamu> mael: ah... but finally what does that vcpu do? probably we must wait for some developers to popup here to ask
03:55 < betonamu> mael: then copy to domU/lib/modules/<version> ?
03:56 < mael> betonamu:  probably
03:56 < mael> I have only used monolithic kernel so far
03:57 < betonamu> any chance to compile the module from inside domU?
03:57 < mael> I think the domU must be able to load the module, so it must be on a FS it has access to
03:57 < mael> betonamu:  why not?
03:57 < betonamu> yes of course the module must stay inside domU filesystem
03:58 < mael> the domU/lib/... stuff was not very clear :)
03:58 < betonamu> mael: what clear?
03:59 < mael> I was not sure about the meaning
04:00 < mael> clear=obvious
04:00 < betonamu> i meant what do you mean by "clear"?
04:01 < betonamu> that is for kernel module of domU. that is very clear
04:01 < mael> I couldn't decide where you planned to put the module :)
04:01 < betonamu> of course in the normal place
04:02 < betonamu> the kernel code to load module doesnt change, rite?
04:02 < mael> I don't think so
04:02 < betonamu> (only machine-dependent code are changed for xen para-virtualization)
04:02 < betonamu> i am sure
04:05 < betonamu> lots of linux syscall remain unchanged in xen. and one of them (sys_create_module) is used to load kernel module
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04:08 < enum> yo, this seems to be a serious issue.  I am using xen 2.0.6, and when using my normal debian kernel everything is fine.  But with xen in dom0 I am getting an error when I do a lot of hd activity
04:08 < enum> hda: Lost Interrupt
04:11 < enum> I feel that I should mention this exact problem is happening on 2 seperate machines
04:18 < betonamu> enum: you should post to devel list, so some gurus might help you
04:19 < mael> ping rusty (strange you're still there at that time :))
04:37 < rusty> mael: ack
04:38 < betonamu> rusty: what is vcpu in unstable? 
04:38 < rusty> betonamu: virtual number of CPUs the domain can use.
04:39 < mael> rusty:  does it works on all arch?
04:39 < rusty> mael: Don't know, actually.
04:39 < mael> ok
04:40 < mael> I think we should send a mail on xen-devel to ask for a new entry in the FAQ
04:42 < mael> it seems to be an interesting feature in the next release but there's almost no info about it in the documentation/presentation nor on the devel ML
04:43 < betonamu> rusty: does that mean we can emulate SMP on an UP?
04:45 < rusty> betonamu: that's part of it, yes.
04:45 < mael> betonamu:  aliguori and unriel have been doing test with vcpu > cpu
04:45  * mael have been avidly digging in the devel ML
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04:48 < betonamu> sweet :)
04:50 < tessier_> mael: The VCPU can be real CPU or not? So I can sell virtual hosting services and tell my customers they are on an 8-way box and charge them a lot of money? :)
04:50 < mael> tessier: yeah it seems this would be possible
04:51 < betonamu> tessier_ : great way to make money :)
04:51 < mael> betonamu:  http://lists.xensource.com/archives/cgi-bin/namazu.cgi?query=vcpu&submit=Search%21&idxname=xen-devel&max=20&result=normal&sort=score
04:51  * tessier_ thinks evil thoughts
04:51  * tessier_ rents time to the DOE on his 1024-way box
04:51 < betonamu> mael: nice
04:52 < betonamu> will take a closer look
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06:01 < tessier_> Anyone using Xen on RHEL4?
06:01 < tessier_> My xen kernel installed from binaries seems to be missing modules required to see my / on lvm
06:02 < tessier_> Wondering if there is an easy fix or if I need to recompile my own xen kernel from the source
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08:48 < rusty> I suspect you are not really on IRC at 5am your time...
08:52 < mael> dunno
08:52 < knewt> i was this morning :/
08:54 < mael> knewt:  so, how is your dm work going?
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10:08 -!- services.oftc.net changed the topic of #xen to: Xen Homepage->  http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/Research/SRG/netos/xen/index.html || Xen Wiki -> http://wiki.xensource.com || vm-tools : http://www.cs.utexas.edu/users/aliguori/vm-tools/
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11:23 < knewt> erm. i somehow don't think there's /any/ chance i'll be able to make it to Canada, when i couldn't even make it to the UK :(
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17:16 < xai> network? why is everyone leaving?
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17:16 < xai> or joining.
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17:58 < knewt> mael: been doing some other stuff just lately, but i'm going to get back to it shortly :)
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20:23 < rusty> niv: ping?
20:30 < rusty> aliguori: ping?
20:30 < niv> heya rusty
20:30 < niv> just sent you an email 
20:31 < rusty> niv: yes, so I jumped on IRC.
20:31 < niv> how goes it?
20:31 < rusty> Just writing my OLS paper.
20:32 < niv> What's your topic?
20:32 < rusty> Anyway, Mike has switched xend to store its persistent data in the store, and I'm trying to get the xenbus driver working.
20:32 < aliguori> hey rusty
20:32 < rusty> niv: nfsim
20:32 < niv> Ah, I remember now
20:32 < rusty> aliguori: When I ^] the console I can't reconnect.
20:33 < aliguori> in vm-tools?  yeah, in the latest version it connects the controlling terminal.. i have to add an option to connect a pty
20:33 < aliguori> rusty: is the store changing in the near future?
20:33 < rusty> aliguori: and I wasn't sure how to use the -B option: I want /dev/hdb to appear as /dev/sda inside.
20:33 < aliguori> rusty: what version are you using?
20:33 < rusty> aliguori: 0.0.4
20:33 < aliguori> cvs is quite different..  there's a vm-vbd command
20:33 < niv> rusty: just what I was about to ask, and is it settled?
20:33 < aliguori> ahh, i see
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20:34 < niv> aliguori: when are you releasing another version of vm-tools?
20:34 < aliguori> niv: the plan is tomorrow
20:34 < aliguori> i just got save/restore working
20:35 < niv> cool!
20:35 < rusty> niv: well, it's kinda settled.  We need to get a prototype so we can properly critique the layout.
20:36 < aliguori> rusty: are the tools responsible for seeting up the data layout?
20:36 < rusty> aliguori: your code is also not really designed to drop into the xen tree AFAICT.
20:36 < aliguori> no, it's not
20:36 < niv> rusty: ok, also, what else will be impacted?
20:36 < knewt> rusty: heh, you're going to canada then i guess?
20:37 < rusty> aliguori: Yes, but the layout is very much in flux.
20:37 < rusty> niv: well, the devices will be impacted, and the tools.  Not much else.
20:37 < rusty> knewt: You mean OLS?  Yes.
20:38 < rusty> aliguori: looks like we're going to go for a UUID for each domain.  I'll probably add that as an arg to xs_introduce, and then the domain can ask the store "who am I?"
20:39 < aliguori> rusty: how's the uuid going to be generated?
20:39 < niv> xenbus being neither in xen nor a bus ;)
20:39 < knewt> rusty: yeah. if i couldn't afford to get to the uk, i don't think i'm going to be able to make canada unfortunately :(
20:39 < rusty> aliguori: the tools make it up.  Then they set up /domain/<uuid>/....
20:40 < rusty> aliguori: the killer is that people want names in Kanji, so using names was going to be nasty.
20:40 < aliguori> rusty: of course
20:41 < rusty> aliguori: and domain ids are local, and people were talking about clusters, so I gave in 8)
20:41 < aliguori> names are not going to be enough too..  i imagine people are going to want groups too
20:41 < aliguori> rusty: yeah, this was inevitable :-)
20:41 < rusty> aliguori: Yeah, tools problem 8)
20:42 < aliguori> as it should be :-)
20:43 < aliguori> rusty: does this mean the store is not going to just deal in strings or are you going to standardize on utf8 or something?
20:44 < rusty> aliguori: it can handle arbitrary data, although everything so far is a string.
20:47 < aliguori> rusty: so does that mean paths must be ascii?
20:47 < aliguori> yeah, i guess that makes sense
20:47 < rusty> Paths must be a-zA-Z0-9-
20:47 < niv> rusty: is the layout still going to resemble the unreadable mess that some other implementations generate?
20:47 < aliguori> oh, ok
20:47 < rusty> And I'm thinking about removing A-Z.
20:47 < rusty> niv: I am fighting against that one now.
20:48 < rusty> niv: I have the OF tree as an example of how not to do it.
20:48 < niv> rusty: yep, that's the one I saw, and really, seemed ghastly
20:48 < rusty> niv: I'm trying to scare them straight 8)
20:49 < niv> rusty: good :) more power to ya!
20:50 < rusty> aliguori: basically xs_linux_build takes two new args: a evtchn and a memory_t *: the evtchn is the evtchn set up by the tool, and the memory_t is the mfn of the shared page set up by the xc_linux_build() function
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20:51 < rusty> aliguori: ie (from my hacked vm-tools-0.0.4): 
20:51 < rusty> +       /* FIXME: handle errors. */
20:51 < rusty> +       xsh = xs_daemon_open();
20:51 < rusty> +       fprintf(stderr, "Opened connection to daemon: %p %s\n",
20:51 < rusty> +               xsh, xsh ? "" : strerror(errno));
20:51 < rusty> +       if (xsh) {
20:51 < rusty> +               if (xc_evtchn_bind_interdomain(xc_handle, DOMID_SELF, domid,
20:51 < rusty> +                                              &store_local_evtchn,
20:51 < rusty> +                                              &store_evtchn) != 0)
20:51 < rusty> +                       perror("xc_evtchn_bind_interdomain failed");
20:52 < rusty> +
20:52 < rusty> +       if (build_domain(xc_handle, domid, store_evtchn, &store_mfn) == -1) {
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20:52 < aliguori> yeah, i've got a store locally and have a version of vm-tools that builds against it :-)
20:52 < aliguori> i haven't committed it to our cvs because we're still going to ship against xen-unstable (which doesn't include the store yet)
20:53 < aliguori> rusty: do you know what's going on in mike wray's tree btw?  it looks like christian and steve are doing a ton of xend work in xen-unstable
20:53 < rusty> aliguori: the store will go in RSN.  Other than the change to the xs_introduce function it's unchanged fotr weeks
20:53 < rusty> aliguori: yes, Mike mentioned that.  He's going to have some merge fun soon.
20:55 < aliguori> rusty: as soon as it goes in, we'll do a store-friendly release :-)  i'll be very happy to get rid of the block device setup code once the store can do that
20:55 < niv> rusty: so we are going to have something fairly soon that will incorporate all of these various efforts?
20:56 < rusty> niv: from the call last night, some of the stuff will just go into the main tree.  Mike and I need to actually get the block devices using this so we can nail down the correct layout of the store.
20:58 < rusty> niv: The various parts are: (1) the xenstore code itself, (2) the xc_linux_build and start_info_t changes for the store shared page, (3) the tools changes to use the new xc_linux_build, (4) the tools changes to actually populate the store, (5) the driver changes to actually use the store.
20:59 < rusty> (1) can go in today.  (2) needs (3) so compile doesn't break, but hopefully late this week.  (4) and (5) are an iterative process as the layout changes.
21:01 < niv> rusty: I don't have access to Mike Wray's tree - is this publicly available? I wanted the API that the drivers will use 
21:02 < rusty> niv: ah, that kinda doesn't exist yet.  I'm writing the xenbus driver, but it as the comment at the top says:
21:02 < rusty> "When this code grows up, it's going to be a bus driver!"
21:03 < aliguori> :-)
21:03 < niv> heh ;)
21:04 < rusty> niv: they may also query the store directly.  THe interface is the same as xs.h in userspace.
21:04 < niv> ah, good to know..
21:07 < rusty> niv: I can send you my current kernel code.
21:07 < niv> rusty: yes, please! many thanks..
21:13 < rusty> niv: sent.
21:14 < niv> I accidentally booted to an old version of Xen (April 12th tarball) and was running tests without noticing and found that all udp datagrams get dropped if less than 1470bytes thereabouts
21:14 < niv> going from dom1 to remote host
21:16 < niv> rusty: thanks! rcvd..
21:16 < niv> Wonder if there is other weirdness that is getting by our testing...
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21:20 < Vip-> Why am I getting an "unable to mount root fs via NFS" when booting the xen.gz?
21:21 < aliguori> Vip-: you don't have a root= parameter in the kernel module line probably
21:21 < Vip-> aligouri: just a sec, this is what I have:
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21:22 < Vip-> title Fedora Core (2.6.11-initrd-xen0)
21:22 < Vip->         root (hd0,1)
21:22 < Vip->         kernel /boot/xen.gz dom0_mem=262144 noreboot
21:22 < Vip->         module /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.11.10-xen0 ro root=/dev/sda2
21:22 < Vip->         module /boot/initrd-2.6.11.10-xen0.img
21:23 < Vip-> I've noticed on boot that sda2 doesn't show up as found.  I can see hdc , the cdrom drive, but nothing else
21:23 < aliguori> Vip-: oh
21:24 < Vip-> And I never get to a line saying "booting domain 0" or something similar
21:24 < aliguori> i bet you didn't enable your scsi controller in the xen kernel config
21:24 < Vip-> ali: :-) I got that too...just a sec :-)
21:24 < aliguori> that error your getting is a linux kernel one
21:24 < Vip-> CONFIG_SCSI_SATA=y
21:25 < aliguori> it means that it cannot find the root device..  usually, it occurs when root= isn't set at all
21:25 < Vip-> CONFIG_SCSI_SATA_PROMISE=m
21:25 < Vip-> Yeah, hrmmm....doh!
21:25 < aliguori> does your initrd have that module in it?
21:25 < aliguori> how did you make that initrd?
21:25 < Vip-> Uh...does this need to be enabled? "# CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDE_SATA is not set"
21:26 < aliguori> i dunno all that much about scsi configuration
21:26 < Vip-> mkinitrd /boot/initrdsomething <kernel-rev-to-use>
21:26 < aliguori> but i'd recommend compilng your scsi drivers in statically
21:26 < aliguori> i've had mixed results with fedora's mkinitrd script and xen
21:27 < Vip-> ok, I'll try a static compile.
21:27 < aliguori> still, that's not quite the error i'd expect if that was the problem
21:27 < aliguori> it usually says something like invalid block device
21:27 < Vip-> Yeah, in this case it tries NFS boot.
21:28 < Vip-> Like I said, I don't see sda2 recognized during the boot
21:33 < Vip-> Should I remove the initrd line from the boot menu?
21:34 < aliguori> the initrd is necessary in fedora because of the way they have their udev setup
21:34 < Vip-> ah , ok
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21:41 < Vip-> ali: so make no changes to the menu.lst for grub?
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21:41 < aliguori> Vip-: yeah, you should be ok with what you have..  have you had any additional luck?
21:41 < Vip-> I just finished the static driver compile...doing mkinitrd
21:42 < Vip-> No module sata_via found for kernel 2.6.11.10-xen0, aborting
21:43 < knewt> it's easy enough to work around the udev issues requiring an initrd. just create the minimal necessary device nodes
21:44 < knewt> i admit i have to use an initrd, but that's because my boot device doesn't even exist until it's been "discovered" by userland
21:45 < Vip-> knewt: what do you mean "minimal necessary device nodes"?
21:49 < knewt> i believe that /dev/console and /dev/null are the minimal required. might be mis-remembering though
21:51 < knewt> oh, you might need /dev/zero actually i think
21:52 < Vip-> ok
21:53 < Vip-> knewt: I have a sata drive, any ideas on how to get it working?
21:54 < knewt> you've built the necessary drivers into the kernel?
21:54 < Vip-> knewt: yes
21:54 < Vip-> CONFIG_SCSI_SATA=y
21:55 < Vip-> CONFIG_SCSI_SATA_PROMISE=y
21:55 < knewt> verified that the same config works on a non-xen kernel?
21:55 < Vip-> oh yeah...heh...not yet :-)
21:55 < Vip-> Probably a good idea, huh?
21:55 < aliguori> Vip-: if you've got the time, i'd recommend taking the fedora kernel config and porting it to xen
21:56 < aliguori> that's what i did for my gentoo system and then i just saved that config...
21:56 < aliguori> there's only a handful of extra xen specific parameters and then some normal ones that xen doesn't like (mostly isa related it seems)
21:57 < Vip-> ali: I've tried that. When I do that it wants to take this x86_64 and compile i386 for it. ???
21:57 < aliguori> ??
21:57 < aliguori> i'm not sure i parse that statement
21:57 < Vip-> ali: I copied the /boot/config-<ver> to .config and ran "make ARCH=xen oldconfig"
21:57 < aliguori> ohhh, i did it by hand
21:58 < rusty> aliguori: you going to OLS?
21:58 < Vip-> ali: then when I do a make ARCH=xen world , it goes off and sets all the architecture stuffs to i386 instead of x86_64
21:58 < aliguori> rusty: yup
21:58 < aliguori> Vip-: oh!  you're on x86_64?
21:58 < aliguori> heheh, ok, all bets are off then :-)
21:58 < Vip-> ali: yeah
21:59 < Vip-> ali: hahaha
21:59 < aliguori> oh, that explains it :_0
21:59 < aliguori> it's entirely possible that the scsi drivers are broken somehow
21:59 < rusty> aliguori: cool.  I'll be in Austin a couple of weeks before, too.
21:59 < knewt> i have a pretty minimal configuration on my server. my laptop (standard ubuntu-built kernel right now) is 493 y, 1386 m. my server is 228 y, 0 m.    *g*
21:59 < Vip-> I got emails from some developers that it should work.
21:59 < aliguori> rusty: cool!
22:00 < Vip-> ali: I know...x86_64 is still in dev cycle :-)
22:00 < aliguori> Vip-: I was hacking on x86_64 till the wee hours of the morning last night.. i don't think it stayed up without oops for more than 15 minutes at a time
22:00 < knewt> Vip-: for now just run as if it's a bog standard i386 box
22:01 < aliguori> Vip-: what kind of machine is this?  my x86_64 machine has SATA drives and that's not a problem
22:02 < Vip-> ali: AMD 64 3000+ w/ Asus K8V motherboard
22:02 < Vip-> ali: really? heh
22:03 < aliguori> yeah, i was hoping you'd say it was an intellistation :-)
22:03 < Vip-> what's intellistation? 
22:04 < aliguori> it's an IBM machine
22:07 < aliguori> ok, i'm gonna head in for the night..
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22:07 < Vip-> too many changes...I'm going to revert back
22:07 < Vip-> to original settings and start over
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22:26 < bunoc> cool. any presentations on Xen at OLS this year?
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--- Log closed Tue May 24 23:59:00 2005